issue20

EMUSIC-L Digest                                      Volume 68, Issue 20

This issue's topics:
	
	Shepard tones and Pink Floyd
	B/A/C/H
	SORRY FOLKS (3 messages)
	SYNTH-MAKERZ! (2 messages)
	SDS DOS/Windows program
	Implied Tonality (or lack thereof...) (2 messages)
	Price of PCM-80
	Grab bag

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Date:         Mon, 5 Sep 1994 11:42:50 WETDST
From:         Gianni Ghigo 
Subject:      Shepard tones and Pink Floyd

Hi
I think no one mentioned this before:
An example of a Shepard tone (in this case
it's an increasing freq.) could be found
at the very end of the Pink Floyd's album
Meddle (sp?) (at least I think it's a Shepard
tone)
Sorry I don't know the name of the track
(echoes???) because I have only a cassette
a friend recorded for me ages ago without
writing the name of the tracks on the label
of the cassette.

Ciao

Gianni

------------------------------
Date:         Mon, 12 Sep 1994 07:20:22 +0000
From:         Jan Magnus Barber 
Subject:      Re: B/A/C/H

         Just a short note. Yes, B/A/C/H IS Bb A C B - but it isn't a
         reversal: in German, Norwegian etc. B = Bb (and H = B) - not the
         other way round!

------------------------------
Date:         Wed, 14 Sep 1994 09:45:35 -0500
From:         Joe McMahon 
Subject:      Re: SORRY FOLKS

>Sorry people, I didnt mean to cause trouble. You wont hear any more from me.
>I thought this was a Music Discussion List? ah well, no matter.
>I didnt know I was bothering you, so again I apoligize.
>Dan

Dan, Marc, et al:

Yes, it is a music discussion list. It is *not* a "your opinions suck"
discussion list, nor is it a music *fandom* discussion list.

Had we been discussing musical technique being used by Roxette or whoever,
no one would have any objection. But we were just whingeing away about
whether or not they were any good.

NOBODY ELSE ON THIS LIST CARES. Take it to allmusic@auvm.american.edu. You
can discuss anything you feel like there.

Now as listowner, I am specifically telling you all to LAY OFF or be
removed from the list. There's such a thing as private e-mail if you want
to argue with someone about something, and especially if it's about their
taste or your preceptions of their viewpoint.

Capiche?

  --- Joe "Vito" M. (EMUSIC-L listowner and arbitrary dictator)

--
"This trumpet is flatlining!" (MST3K, "Mr. B. Natural")

------------------------------
Date:         Wed, 14 Sep 1994 11:00:37 EDT
From:         Alper Kerman 
Subject:      Re: SORRY FOLKS

> Capiche?
>
>   --- Joe "Vito" M. (EMUSIC-L listowner and arbitrary dictator)

             ^^^^

Hey Joe,

Are you the "Vito" of "Carleone"s?  Cuz, if you are, I wouldn't wanna
be in "that Marc"s shoes right about now!  I couldn't imagine just
waking up one morning and finding a decapitated head of a horse at my
feet!...Weeeuuuuhh!...Frightening stuff!....   ;^)

- The Young Turk  ;^)

------------------------------
Date:         Wed, 14 Sep 1994 11:17:04 -0500
From:         Joe McMahon 
Subject:      Re: SORRY FOLKS

>Are you the "Vito" of "Carleone"s?  Cuz, if you are, I wouldn't wanna
>be in "that Marc"s shoes right about now!  I couldn't imagine just
>waking up one morning and finding a decapitated head of a horse at my
>feet!...Weeeuuuuhh!...Frightening stuff!....   ;^)

No, no, this is an emusic list. It's a Theremin with the antennae cut off. :)

 --- Joe M.

--
"This trumpet is flatlining!" (MST3K, "Mr. B. Natural")

------------------------------
Date:         Fri, 16 Sep 1994 14:38:50 +1000
From:         DAVID O'DONOGHUE 
Subject:      SYNTH-MAKERZ!

>Regretfully, the factory presets are nowhere to be found in the ROM.  You can
>call Korg TECH support and find out how to get a copy of the factory load on
>card at (516)333-USER.

Really, isn't it time for the synth-makers to start supporting their userbase
properly?
When are they going to start up-loading this sort of stuff to a FTP site
somewhere?
When are they going to put product info up on WWW?
Or even a Mail server........
Most of us would know about the MIDI vendor forums on COMPUSERVE,
but of course those forums are expensive to access. (I Dont know about
elsewhere, but COMPUSERVE is extremely expensive in Australia....I guess we can
thank Fujitsu for a good portion of that!)

Any company serfs from Roland/Ensoniq/Korg/Kurzweil/Emu/Kawai/Yamaha/Alesis
(forgive me if I've missed any) listening?

Regards

David O'Donoghoe
DODON@OZEMAIL.COM.AU
PH: 61 07 849 7088 (bh) 61 07 806 0276 (ah)
P.O.Box 3442
Loganholme Q4129
Australia

------------------------------
Date:         Fri, 16 Sep 1994 10:02:15 -0400
From:         "Keith C. Perry" 
Subject:      Re: SYNTH-MAKERZ!

>>Regretfully, the factory presets are nowhere to be found in the ROM.  You can
>>call Korg TECH support and find out how to get a copy of the factory load on
>>card at (516)333-USER.
>
>Really, isn't it time for the synth-makers to start supporting their userbase
>properly?

I have to agree with that.  In this day in age where you have literally
transport midi data over WAN (such as the internet) you would think that
the sys ex dump for various machine would be availible on the net.  If all
you need is the factory presets maybe some on here can sys exe the data for
you and then convert it to a standard midi file and email it to you.  I
would do it but alas as I have said before I don't use Korg equipment that
much so I don't have any in my possesion.  Good Luck !



===+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+===
Keith C. Perry 800-836-4599                   /\ "To be or not to be...
Floor Supervisor / Senior Consultant          \/     THAT AIN'T A QUESTION"
Drexel University Office of Computing Services--|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
...

------------------------------
Date:         Sat, 17 Sep 1994 13:43:12 CDT
From:         HARRY HAECKER 
Subject:      SDS DOS/Windows program

I'm looking for a program that will allow me to dump a sample
from my K2000RS to my computer in sample dump standard form, and
then save it as a wave file, where I can then edit it and dump it
back to the sampler, using Mike Wood's MDump (thanks, Mike...a useful
program you have there!

Does such a beast exist at an FTP site somewhere?  I'd appreciate any
help y'all could give!

Harry Haecker

------------------------------
Date:         Mon, 19 Sep 1994 10:46:43 CST
From:         Darwin Grosse 
Subject:      Implied Tonality (or lack thereof...)

Uhhh, I need some help - and don't know where to look for myself...

While in college, I participated in several performance groups.  While not
a blazing member of any individual group, I did listen closely to the end
result, and made some notes on some of the performances.

Recently, I ran across some of those notes, and they have piqued my interest
in subjects that I'd wanted to pursue at the time (12 long years ago).  The
most curious - for me - was perceived tonality.  I noticed that in several
performances, the tonal center of the work would become blurred or even
misleading (to me as a soloist).  This would most often occur with "odd-ball"
instrumentation (as a guitar-synth soloist, it was inevitable that I'd end
up categorized in this way), and would even occur with well-known or straight-
ahead scores.  Some examples (of course, examples where I choked during
rehearsals):

o  A "guitar big band", 15 guitars split in three sections, each reading a
   trumpet, trombone or sax score.  Mostly good players, very little
   unintentional "klangwerks".  All electric guitars at a reasonable volume,
   no effects except a slight reverb applied to each section.

o  A "monsters of percussion" group.  A number of tuned percussionists (that
   is, percussionists using tuned instruments), with traps, bass and that
   goofy guitar-synth.  Most perc instruments were of the vibes/marimba
   group, with only a few "carefully selected hubcap" players.  The score
   was extremely cleanly written, of reasonable tempo, and featured constant
   but non-random chord changes.

o  A "band for dogs and whales".  Only very high and very low pitched acoustic
   and electronic instruments.  Reading slow tempo, lushly written scores.
   This one especially tweaked me, since the score (on first reading) seemed
   a breeze, sounded beautiful when listening to the tape,  but the tonal
   center turned wicked in the playing...

The commonality here is strange timbres on tonal music.  In these three cases,
the instumentation was non-stock, consisting of instruments with high
harmonic content, and often at extremes of pitch range.  In none of these
cases was the tonal center meant to be obscured.  Also, my physical position
in the various groups seemed irrelivant, since other soloist (in different
physical locations) seemed to have the same problem in the same sections of
a given score.  My question:

  Is there any body of work that addresses the effect on timbre on the
  perception of pitch (somewhat) and tonal center?  I'm sure there is, but
  I never ran across anything that I found insightful, nor anything that
  touched on a player's perception (as opposed to the uninvolved listener's).

This is an area that I would like to explore in my own compositions ...
as well as being aware of it when writing for other musicians.  Any
information that is available would be appreciated.

Well, this is the first time I blushingly beg for help without having done
any front-end legwork...  :-<  I'm just a little shy of local resources,
and don't know where to get a good start.

Let me start with a few caveats:

1. I do not live near any source of "serious" compositional or emusic
   information; hence, information that might be easy to find in "any
   university library" may not be easy for me to get.

2. While I studied Composition and Performance in college, it's been a
   (very?) long time.  My primary study area was also in Jazz Studies -
   a group that doesn't put much truck in blinking LED's.

3. I'm searching more for theoretical discussion than for actual scores
   or recorded examples.

Thanks in advance for any help you can provide, and I hope that you find
interest.  While not strictly "E"music, I think that emusic works would
present more opportunity for this type of excitement.

[ddg]
..............................................................................
  Darwin Grosse  .    (414) 377-2946(h)/359-9800(w)    .  ddg@devlac.ems.com
..............................................................................

------------------------------
Date:         Mon, 19 Sep 1994 14:26:36 -0400
From:         Mark G Simon 
Subject:      Re: Implied Tonality (or lack thereof...)

>
> Recently, I ran across some of those notes, and they have piqued my interest
> in subjects that I'd wanted to pursue at the time (12 long years ago).  The
> most curious - for me - was perceived tonality.  I noticed that in several
> performances, the tonal center of the work would become blurred or even
> misleading (to me as a soloist).  This would most often occur with "odd-ball"
> instrumentation (as a guitar-synth soloist, it was inevitable that I'd end
> up categorized in this way), and would even occur with well-known or straight-
> ahead scores.  Some examples (of course, examples where I choked during
> rehearsals):
>
> o  A "guitar big band", 15 guitars split in three sections, each reading a
>
> o  A "monsters of percussion" group.  A number of tuned percussionists (that
>
> o  A "band for dogs and whales".  Only very high and very low pitched acoustic

My own wild and ill-informed guess is that you might be hearing
difference tones. I hear difference tones when 2 woodwind instruments
play in a high register, but I'm a woodwind player. It's possible that
your band for dogs and whales produced some difference tones also that
confused your ear. Difference tones are (and this is going to be an
exceptionally crude explanation) when the overtones of two sounding notes
rub against each other and reinforce each other and produce a third pitch
which kind of buzzes in your ear or just behind your ear. You can even
calculate which difference tones are going to sound between two
instruments. I have something written about this at home somewhere, but
will I ever find it?

Mark Simon
mgs2@cornell.edu

------------------------------
Date:         Mon, 26 Sep 1994 08:46:06 LCL
From:         Michael Carnes 
Subject:      Price of PCM-80

----------
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I don't want to do a blurb on the PCM-80 here.  Let it suffice to
say that the list price is in the neighborhood of $2500 U.S. and that
it is shipping now.

------------------------------
Date:         Wed, 28 Sep 1994 12:14:52 -0500
From:         Macalester College Music Department 
Subject:      Re: Grab bag

to the list:

today there was a posting of the cubase address in England. When I tried it I
got an incorrect address prompt. I checked again and am sure I used what was
posted. Has anyone else had the same result, did I make an error which escaped
my second look, and could someone post that address again, please.

Thanks in advance
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
+ Ed Forner                         Macalester College Music Department +
+ in%"forner@macalstr.edu"          voice (612) 696-6189                +
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+

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End of the EMUSIC-L Digest
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